Ash states, "OKAY! Topics: Violet's up first."
Famine states, "Go back to fishing."
Anonymous trails off, "You harass ash on discord ONE TOO MANY TIMES..."
Petal grins at Famine.
Ash grins at Anonymous.
Violet states, "Ah OKAY"
Violet states, "I get this is super early days and beta and stuff, and this is probably at the very bottom of your priority list but i'm just gonna go ahead with it"
Ash states, "You were an excellent guide on AE. I think we've just got all we need and I don't want the list too big for the pbase."
Ash nods at Violet.
Famine claims, "You'd be surprised at how much we might decide is worth doing early rather than later."
Violet states, "I'm not really sure what the point of the performance skills are? They don't really interact with the core gameplay mechanics (crafting and scavenging) in a meaningful way, and as far as I understand increasing your skill in them doesn't actually do anything? With learn slots being as limited as they are, and PvE being a big focus, they seem kind of pointless. The increased rpxp gain is nice, but you can get that without dedicating any learn slots to any of the relevant skills. "
Violet asks, "I mentioned it in the Discord at some point, but I feel like having some kind of moraale system or similar that performance skills could interact with could be really cool. I feel like performances providing actual buffs could feel a little too gamey, but that was also an idea that came to mind. That, and also maybe the rpxp gain should actually increase with your skill level?"
Petal muses, "Do they still increase RPXP gain?"
Anonymous says, "Yeah"
Anonymous states, "Afaik"
Sarah states, "Scaling rpxp gain could be cool though"
Anonymous states, "So uh"
Famine claims, "I wouldn't mind seeing some kind of morale bonus that could come with listening/watching someone perform."
Ketavan nods at Famine.
Petal nods at Famine.
Famine claims, "For a more mechanical benefit"
Anonymous says, "There was a solution about this tossed around on TI not too far back that i would mention"
Crayon says, "I think that a morale system that scales RP XP based on a wider range of factors to include actual skill level (or items like Walkmen) would be fantastic."
Ketavan claims, "I would like to see non-com characters get as much love as they possibly can tbh"
Anonymous claims, "And that was that during a performance, your pool drained faster. b ut they later changed that to just 'in a scene, pool drains faster'."
Sarah nods at Ketavan.
zombilicious states, "Morale would be great, since we have no radios and music is a huge part of human culture."
Famine claims, "Potentially make the bonus a better one based on level of the performance skill"
Petal says, "Tiny increased healing rate around performaners 😃"
Violet wonders, "It's also a bit... odd? That it seems like the best way to level up your performance skills is just to sit in a room alone and spam nonsense 🙁"
Ash states, "For performing skills it kind of touches on what the baseline purpose of the game is - the RP. A lot of things don't have mechanical purposes beyond their use and ability to represent your skill level in them while roleplaying. With that said, we are definitely taking a stronger focus on mechanics than we ever had before on TFZ, like just purely by necessity to try and create a PvE experience"
Lance inquires, "Can alternatively set them to some kind of "hobby" skill slot? so they dont feel like theyre losing something for nothing"
Anonymous claims, "I spent like. a year and a half trying to learn how to play a saxophone doing just that and i still sucked at it, seems relaistic"
Ruby is idle.
Lance states, "But also Bards tho"
Sarah says, "Having pool accumulate faster during active RP would be cool"
Ash asks, "What would you think of performing adding a little boost affect to people there to hear it?"
Ruby has returned from AFK.
zombilicious claims, "Performance gives that luck bonus, heckity."
Sarah states, "Like performing in front of someone pools the perform skill faster"
Sarah nods at Ash.
zombilicious exclaims, "BARDIC INSPIRATION!"
zombilicious remembered it.
Petal nods at Ash.
Anonymous states, "Oh god dont get me started"
Anonymous states, "I hate bardes"
Famine says, "Huh... that's not a bad idea. Performance being the only place you could get an Edge bonus from."
Anonymous claims, "Bards*"
Ketavan nods at Famine.
Murrmurs says, "Back to the gamey, but morale as impacting ability to fight or stay out of town might be neat"
zombilicious states, "No one asked you, Space Cowboy."
Petal states, "I like the idea of a boost affect Ash."
zombilicious peers at anon.
Murrmurs trails off, "Yeah... giving the party bards"
Corene says, "You could also rest up faster during a performance, since music can be v. relaxing"
Anonymous says, "Well yer gettin' it anyway partner"
zombilicious flails around.
Sarah says to Anonymous, "Excuse you rootin tootin batman"
zombilicious muses, "Shouldn't it be 'pardner'?"
Anonymous says, "Im batman"
Ash claims, "I think I'd want to avoid morale systems solely because it would feel a little too out of game character for the game's mechanics to tell you how your character feels, but there's lots of stuff that could be done with performance skills to give them at least some kind of mechanical impact."
Violet claims, "Right now I just kind of feel like that one asshole at a party playing Wonderwall"
zombilicious claims, "Hey, I like Wonderwall."
Petal nods at Ash.
Anonymous says, "Repeating in case it was missed: faster pool draining into skill ranks during performances"
Petal states, "I like that idea too Anon."
Sarah claims, "One summer i stayed in a hostel while i was travelling and there was a girl who played wonderwall for a solid 4 hours a day"
Corene trails off, "THis is getting into very detailed stuff and so not sure if it's worth it, but there could be a movement regain bonus for soothing music and a movement....upping...bonus for others"
Petal says, "Fits into the whole music is inspiring thing."
Ash claims, "That would be a pretty long term kind of change, I reckon. Not crazy but just more complicated to knock out. "
Corene questions, "Maybe make it via genre?"
Ash trails off, "You know..."
Anonymous states, "I win"
Corene states, "You could set the room to 'punk'"
Anonymous claims, "I got ash into saying 'i reckon'"
Corene claims, "And RP a concert"
Corene states, "And everybody gets hype and their mv goes up "
NotChloe states, "Now you just need to get her to start saying yeehaw"
Famine claims, "Ash has been saying I reckon since long before you, boy."
Ash states, "If listening to a performance upped your perception it could handle the boost to pooling without having to touch pooling on the code end at all."
Petal wonders, "Could you get faster pool rates with a +int effect?"
Ash nods at Petal.
Anonymous claims, "Dont make me be the fun police and crash the party to quiet down all this hooliganism because this is a nice quiet neighborhood"
zombilicious says, "Really anything that would make performance skills feel mechanically beneficial. I know it can be hard to be the Odd Man Out having the quote-unquote unseless skill."
Eli claims, "I got a topic after everyone else"
Petal states, "You had the same idea heh"
Violet says, "Yeah, I don't mind it having soft benefits, but it feels kind of unrewarding to spend your learn slots on performance stuff currently"
Petal says, "I think that's fair."
Daniel muses, "Busking?"
Ash says, "I think it'll largely be one of those things that folks either want it for the RP or don't think it's worth it for that purpose, but still think it ought to get a little something."
Corene states, "I know RP itself SHOULD be rewarding, but a ton of this game is PVE and a LOT of interaction comes from things like scav runs"
zombilicious states, "I was already planning to be a singer when this character inevitably dies because she will."
NotChloe says, "Im gonna start doing weird interpretive dance in the campsite to make people so uncomfortable they learn their skills faster."
Famine states, "This kinda would add to a more lived in vibe. You go do a lot of hard work which naturally gets that pool full then hit the rest area where someone's probably gonna perform."
Petal says, "Especially as writing up music stuff is kinda a big effort kinda thing. So a reward is nice."
Sarah nods at Famine.
zombilicious claims, "The RP should be rewarding, but sometimes it can feel unrewarding depending on who's around, too."
Ash inquires, "How much of a bonus do you guys think?"
Famine claims, "Work hard, play hard, ultimately both together benefits compounds"
Corene claims, "Pace run costs no mvn 'cause NotChloe inspired you to zip away"
Sarah claims, "I will say as someone who thrives on praise, i do like performing singing just to see people emote about how great i am"
Murrmurs questions, "Tied to mastery, ash?"
Petal questions, "How much of a bonus to stats would you need for it to have an impact?"
NotChloe says, "I like that thinking Famine"
Sarah brushes herself off
Ash claims to Murrmurs, "Oooh, that's a good idea."
zombilicious claims, "You don't need to do anything, Sarah, you're great anyways."
Petal claims, "And yeah, tied to skill level is good."
Sarah sparkles aggressively
Crayon states, "Yeah, having it scale based on skill would make most sense for making higher skill levels feel rewarding."
Sarah places a silver tiara glittering with large diamonds and sapphires onto her head.
zombilicious claims, "I bragged about having a Sarah-made Quiver to people the other night."
zombilicious states, "Pfft. Even your tiara is prettier than mine."
zombilicious stops using a silver tiara glittering with large diamonds and sapphires.
zombilicious places a silver tiara glittering with large diamonds and sapphires onto her head.
Ash says, "So like if you barely know music you might get a little bump to pooling rates via int or per benefits, but if you're a GM people are coming away with a fantastic aff."
Sarah nods at Ash.
Famine asks, "+5, +10, +15 bonus scaling by mastery level?"
NotChloe claims, "I want to sing more but like... I can't songwrite so will need to find ways to keep up a performance of describing the singing and what the general sound is."
Petal states, "Or... length of the effect based on skill level."
Ash says, "COuld do both even."
Petal nods at Ash.
Violet claims, "I think that sounds dope"
Petal says, "I like it."
Murrmurs asks, "For a modest extension of the concept, some relaxed affect tied to MV/Per/Healing gain could be nice? I'm assuming there's desire to have the skill apply when out doing scary stuff and not only being ideal for campfire scenes"
Famine inquires, "Maybe length tied to magnetism level?"
Petal nods at Murrmurs.
Murrmurs states, "Ooh duration once buffed neat yes"
NotChloe claims, "Making mag actually useful would be nice"
Petal states, "Length tied to magnetism sounds good."
Crayon says OOCly, "I'd be hesitant to see healing made any faster again."
Corene claims, "Yeah, that's what I meant by performaces for different kinds of music upping things"
Corene says, "It would be a buff that lasts"
Corene claims, "You go to a punk show and then you come out like IMMA FUCK UP SOME ZOMBIES or IMMA MAKE FIFTY TABLES"
Famine says, "Rofl imma make fifty tables"
Petal says, "I think you can make healing faster without it being heal in 5 minutes."
Famine says, "THEN FLIP THEM ALL"
Ash states, "Okay, added perception or int bonus if you stick around for a performance, rate of impact based on performer's skill, length of impact based on performer's mag"
Corene states, "Exactly Famine that's the point of the tables"
Petal nods at Ash.
Violet exclaims, "Awesome!"
Andruid states, "I love it. This would really incentivize the performer role, which would be great. Fewer skills and slots means there's a lot of overlap in skillsets, which has its own pros and cons."
Ash declaims, "Agreed! This sounds like it could play out very cool"
Famine claims, "I think this could solve the issue of just not having a lot of performer types."
Ketavan states, "Yeah like I said, I'd like to incentivize massively people not making combat characters. There shouldn't be a drive to get into combat simply to feel helpful."
Misty claims, "I look forward to my future screamo concert."
Ash pontificates, "Lets see here... next up was Sarah. Have at, Sarah!"
Ash grins at Misty.
NotChloe states, "Random question... do we have generic prop objects in carpentry/welding? Like for tooling into things like razors, jenga games, a steel carved portrait of John Ross's mum."
Andruid nods at Ketavan.
Sarah claims, "So I have been thinking about the recent discussions about interdependence (basically players being required to rely on each other to get access to all items/resources) since the BEE DEBACLE & normally I find a lack of access to resources just stonewalls RP, but am now realizing that with rprequests staff have created a system where sometimes not being able to access resources is more rewarding than having them."
Sarah claims, "I think it would be cool to take that into account when balancing resources/deciding what's going to be available for purchase on grid. Like if we could buy honey on grid to make Sarah a cold remedy, we wouldn't have had a cascading bee debacle that pulled the whole grid in."
Famine claims to NotChloe, "We do. Handheld object is typically just props."
Mutters states, "Yes, NotChloe, Carpentry and Welding both have 'trinkets' that can be retooled into most anything."
Famine says, "Ah yeah, trinket"
zombilicious states, "Sewing does too."
Ash nods at Sarah.
Sarah claims, "And was wondering if im wilding out over here or other people were enjoying the scarcity and wanting to preserve it"
zombilicious says, "I made a pillow with sewing."
Atlas says, "At the moment, lack of resources is partly because we simply haven't gotten around to implementing certain things on grid yet. We try to compensate with rprequest scenes. However it is still planned for many resources to only be acquirable outside of the Free Zone itself."
NotChloe questions, "Rprequests? Does that cost karma?"
Atlas glances at Ash, "Assuming that is still the case?"
Ash says, "Nah, those are free."
Atlas says, "It does not. It asks a staff member to come hold a scene for you."
zombilicious claims, "I like the scarcity. That said, Sarah got REALLY BAD before we were able to make that tea."
Ash nods at Atlas.
Murrmurs claims, "I love resources being tight."
Sarah says to zombilicious, "It was fun though im a drama queen"
zombilicious states, "To the point where I could only understand one or two letters in anything she said."
Atlas trails off, "I would have been willing to hold that scene earlier... but no one put in an rprequest until she was bad 😉"
Sarah claims, "IM SICKLY AND DELICATE"
Famine trails off, "Hm..."
zombilicious states, "It was hilarious, but I felt so bad that your communication abilities were cut off so vast."
Sarah states, "IM A BYRONIC HEROINE IM GONNA DIE"
Ketavan claims to Sarah, "I'm torn. The problem being that the artifical scarcity drives me to 'want' to play 20 hours a day because people will and constantly do out-perform me in terms of online hours, leading me to not get as much. That being said, I do think scarcity genuinely improves any PvE game, and historically those games/MUDs who have leaned into that have had more longterm player security after the initial dropoff."
Ash asks of Sarah, "We tossed around the idea of tying scav availability to the resources metric. If I'm understanding correctly you're saying you prefer the scarcity, as opposed to asking for easier access?"
Sarah nods at Ash.
zombilicious raises her hand.
Sarah claims, "I like that needing something important prompts more d&d like quest scenes"
Petal states, "I think having some resources as scarse and available through rprequests, and staff things is a good thing, but not the majority."
Andruid says, "I think just being strategic about when and where to introduce scarcity can help balance out the needs/playstyles."
NotChloe states, "Id want to make sure new players and characters arent fuxked over with scarcity."
Ash states, "Stuff should definitely be -pretty- scarce, at least in the sense that going out to get things is dangerous enough that it's not a walk in the park. Stuff is there, but it can be scary to get, if that makes sense."
Ketavan claims, "I will say... Is there any benefit to raising scavenging? Mines getting pretty high but I haven't noticed any codewise difference, and I'm very hesitant in asking for the rprequest because I don't like 'bothering the imms,' which might just be a me thing, but."
Petal claims, "RPRequest isn't always available to everyone and I figure staff don't want to be tied up with them constantly either."
zombilicious claims, "I did want to ask this another day, but in "a grassy" rooms like Massey Park, it would be cool if we could find rare scavengables that are honey."
zombilicious says, "Since bees tend to live in those areas."
Famine states, "I wonder if we could tie some scarcity to season."
Mutters states, "I mean there's a lot that goes on into surviving, and I think that IP for tasks is good as well as more maintenance into the grid is what I'd like to see. Scarcity drives maintenance and roleplay, things to do."
Sarah claims, "Seasonal resources would be reeeally cool"
NotChloe states, "Its hard enough trying to establish yourself, even harder if old characters hoard everythinf."
Crayon states, "I like things being harder to get but I don't like them being harder to get in a way that leads to like, half the MUD frantically competing over the same 2-3 scav locations."
Murrmurs states, "Scavenging levels have not felt particularly rewarding, which is a bit of a let down given how central it is to theme."
Ash says to Ketavan, "Higher it is the more scav you can find. Rarer items are pretty impossible to guess, impossible to find, and impossible to locate if you don't have it high enough to see them"
Sarah nods at Crayon.
Nappist claims, "On the one hand, having a scarcity is good. On the other hand, being unable to play/forced to interact with game mechanics when you might want to just goof off isn't. So I'm going to disagree that "forced" or "required" maintenance. But as it stands, certain high-quality items or materials are just way too common."
Crayon says, "Which combined with what Murrmurs mentions is why I think Scavenging will probably need looked at as a system eventually, yeha."
Ketavan nods at Ash.
Eli claims, "The settelment should just have tech levels or something"
Murrmurs claims, "Specifically that once someone knows an item is in a room that they can scav without skill."
zombilicious states, "Even better if it was seasonal, yeah. I don't feel like adding new scavs causes issue with scarcity either, since it'd be in a place regularly picked over for other necessary resources."
Corene trails off, "Things like....the wall needing repair and strengthening could be useful for welders, for example"
Petal states, "I think as it is, sometimes players can very much just treat... scavenging like.. an OOC thing almost. Waiting for the tick to pop, hitting all the sites. Clearing them. And it can make it really hard for newbies (and oldbies that don't go down that route) to get a foot in."
Sarah claims to zombilicious, "Im here for the pre-winter pickling/canning/jam making rp"
Eli claims, "Spend all that hoarded stuff into 'improving' it then bakc to scarce"
Ash claims, "They can, but they're not likely to pull it up."
Ash states, "RE: Murr."
Crayon states, "They can just keep doing it until they get it."
zombilicious states, "Yaaas, queen, we'll have our Hot Female-Presenting Canning Season."
Mutters claims, "There defintely needs to be more money and resource sinks in the game, I think."
Nappist claims, "What Petal says is true, but also, I've found plenty of areas that have absolutely no zed and are never picked over further out"
Sarah claims to zombilicious, "Sarah stands around licking a wooden spoon while linnea does all the work"
Nappist claims, "You usually have to explore a lot, be careful, and occasionally slip by.. oh. yeah."
Nappist claims, "Patrols"
NotChloe states, "The idea of gaming scav ticks sounds icky. But ive not run into issues whenever Ive gone out to scav."
Ash claims, "If they run out of MV doing that and need to regen it with some food or time, net win. All in all, I'd prefer to spend 10 seconds and 5 MV finding something than an hour and my whole pool."
zombilicious claims to Sarah, "I'd do it, just to RP with youuu."
Nappist muses, "Oh right. is someone logging this?"
Ash questions, "I have a suspicion that this might ease up on itself given time as the novelty of scavving fades a bit?"
Mutters states, "I am logging, Nappist."
Sarah claims, "<3"
zombilicious asks, "There have, in the past, been instances of camping in certain scav spots, I've heard. But it's also hearsay. That said, I think it's gotten better?"
Famine claims, "I do wonder if with some of the regen changes, if that might even out the scavenging a bit since you won't want to waste as much mv trying for stuff you aren't high enough for"
Petal states, "I think a big part of it is just.. at the moment there's a higher demand for certain things cause we're all new at once and setting up."
zombilicious states, "I enjoy scavenging for my herbs and stuff."
Nappist claims, "<3"
Ash nods at Petal.
Petal claims, "The nails and stuff help a lot with that."
Ketavan claims, "Yeah, as time goes on it'll get better. For now, the economy is struggling."
Mutters claims, "The metal economy has gone from everything to zero to everything again."
Crayon states, "Yeah, I do think regen changes should help. As should adding new stuff so there's more diversity of places."
Nappist claims, "The economy is having a lot of weird swings, yes."
Ash says to Petal, "Kinda what I'm thinking, plus we're a brand spankin' new game so everything's shiny and has novelty factor."
Ash grins at zombilicious.
Corene says, "The economy being all over the place adds to the immersion, for me"
Nappist claims, "We'll probably see what's in over-abundance, what's in under-abundance, what needs to be moved around, etc."
Famine muses to Ash, "What if we did a command delay if you fail a scav roll, potentially putting yourself in danger to zombies walking in on you?"
Mutters states, "My topic hits on economy, so I'll get more in depth there."
NotChloe asks, "Mark it down as tentatively observe for now?"
zombilicious claims, "I totally forgot to make that pickled egg desc while I was up here."
Petal grins at Famine.
Eli claims, "Fine with that scav change"
Petal says, "I like how you think Famine."
Ash says, "We could just make it so you can't find stuff you don't have the skill for, difficult or no, tbh."
Sarah inquires to Mutters, "Is this segueing into your topic in a way where we could jump to it?"
Sarah says, "Er if mutters is next in line"
Corene says, "I like that solution, Ash"
zombilicious claims to Ash, "I think that'd be better, actually."
NotChloe claims, "I thought thats what it was Ash"
Crayon says, "But I do agree with Murrmurs. Personally I have like half as much scav as he does, am like 90 percent as effective, and kicked increasing scavenging down to last on my list of things to do."
Andruid says, "Some of the hoarding right now might just be due to folks not knowing what's going to turn out to be useful yet."
zombilicious says to Ash, "Because like, it's weird to me that I can go out and scavenge up metal scraps if I can't see them."
Ash nods at Andruid.
Petal nods at Crayon.
Ash says, "Okay lets do that"
Famine claims, "If we limited it like that, we could add some bigger scavengeables to the higher end without hurting scarcity too much"
Crayon claims, "And yeah, I do think that's a good change."
NotChloe says, "Sounds great famine."
Anonymous claims, "Remember that each room is 3 scavenges only"
Corene states, "I like the idea of high scavenging being really useful"
Corene says, "As someone who really enjoys scavenging as a mechanic"
NotChloe claims, "Same. Especially as im using slots on it XD"
zombilicious states, "It'd also help in instances later on when we have a Grandmaster Scavenger so that some newbie scavver isn't outdoing them on fancy stuff."
NotChloe claims, "I love the rp idea of being a scavver tbh"
Corene high-fives Not!Chloe
(advice) Player Daniel: If I have to log off in the meeting zone, will I come back where my PC was before and get eaten by zombies, or does it always send you into town?
(advice) Staff Ash: I can transfer you to camp if you'd like.
(advice) Player Daniel: Thanks
NotChloe says, "Im a long way from grandmaster scav... but I'll get there."
Crayon claims, "Yeah, I just wait to see what the master scavvers turn up then start scavving for the good stuff I can't see like a jerk. ;_;"
Ketavan says, "Scavengers are already useful, I'd just like to see them be useful to the point where combat characters make way for them to come with on purpose."
Ash gasps at Crayon.
Famine states, "Rofl"
Famine claims, "That's so sneaky"
zombilicious states to Ketavan, "They are, but I think it'd be more rewarding for someone who's used up a GM slot on Scavenging to actually be better at finding cooler things."
Murrmurs claims, "A separate scavenging thought I've beaten around with is tying room scav to a character, and scaling number of attempt so skill."
(advice) Guide Sarah: Staff can transfer you or you can go 'down' from here to get back on grid
Down - Halfway Between Dreams and Reality
zombilicious says to Ash, "Crayon's lying, he at least waited until the character pointed it out to him."
Corene claims, "I do really, really appreciate all of you who go out on runs and let us less skilled peeps come out to build them skillz"
zombilicious states, "Unlike me. I scavenged leeches I couldn't see. I'm a failure."
Ash states, "I saw that idea. Ended up nixing it for scarcity purposes."
NotChloe muses, "Interesting idea murrmurs... but could get wild with a big group?"
Murrmurs states, "That alongside exhausting the slots to attempt at on a fail + only scav what you have skill for + zomb threat"
Murrmurs states, "Would make leveling scav really neat"
Corene claims, "It's lovely that people aren't like "get out, N00B" re runs"
Murrmurs nods at Ash.
Crayon says, "On ARPI it was changed to be based on the character rather than the room so that everybody in a group could get one attempt and you didn't have people trying to fast trigger finger the command or fighting over who gets to scav and so you didn't have to worry much about people trying to snipe scav locations before each other, etc."
NotChloe states, "I do enjoy inviting myself on rubs"
Famine inquires, "What if you could only scav one thing per room per character but the room itself could still exhaust with 3 things?"
NotChloe states, "RUNA"
NotChloe states, "Runs*"
Crayon states, "Or maybe that change was early on in PRPI."
Ash states, "It's not a bad idea tbh ,I think it would balloon things a little too much for taste"
Corene states, "I'll invite you on rubs, Chloe"
Corene waggles her eyebrows
Murrmurs claims, "Perhaps not intended, but as-is, characters who all begin threading scav in a room at the same time all get a chance to succeed."
Murrmurs claims, "Regardless of it's got 1 or 3 charges"
Ash claims, "Unintended but I kinda like it"
Andruid says, "Something to sort out within the group."
Famine states, "On the subject of seasonal scarcity - We could tie seed restocks to season maybe."
zombilicious trails off, "I can just imagine some rooms where we've all done things like 'Scavenge X for this person.' and getting 2x as many because everyone in the group got a chance to get 1 item would be a lot..."
Murrmurs claims, "I do too; was just pointing at re: player gets 1-3 personal shots at a room as the baseline"
Murrmurs claims, "Which is already what effectively happens with large groups"
Corene claims, "Seasonal scarcity makes things like canning useful, too"
zombilicious states to Famine, "That'd be nice, i think, especially since we can't plant a lot of seeds in the weather."
Ash muses, "Do we largely like the scav availability tied to the resources metric btw?"
NotChloe states, "I think it makes sense."
Andruid pontificates, "May I get a trans out, please? I've got an Andor date soon. 😃 Thanks for the meeting!"
Eli states, "MKes sense"
Mutters asks, "Are we able to do projects to increase metrics or are they tied to RPRequests?"
Ash waves to Andruid.
NotChloe states, "Would be interesting to trial"
Famine wonders to Ash, "What would it do? Base number of scavs before room exhausts on the metric?"
zombilicious starts writing a note. (This is an OOC action)
Eli states, "Hopefully its a projects tjing"
Eli says, "And people have to fight for votes"
Eli trails off, "Political rp always gud.... in moderation..."
Ash claims to Famine, "Yeah, I think that was the idea - it was a Yuki idea that got lodged in my brain."
Famine claims, "That could be really cool"
Stitch is idle.
Ash claims, "So if it's tanked, maybe rooms only have 1 thing you can scavenge from it. If it's not tanked, 5 things. Average 3."
Crayon claims, "At the risk of derailing (or segueing) into Mutters' topic, I worry that the nails craft might have broken the economy of Welding by making steal too accessible. On the other hand, before it was so tight in availability people were bickering about scavving it, so I'm not sure where the middle ground is."
zombilicious aborts writing her note.
zombilicious starts writing a note. (This is an OOC action)
Petal says, "If you double the number of nails required to make an ingot you could make it a bit tighter."
Ketavan says, "Double nails to ingots would be my initial reaction. Current 5:1, turn to 10:1"
Ash states, "We can do that."
Petal nods at Ketavan.
Mutters states, "That seems right in line."
Murrmurs says, "I love metric idea! Only note is that group scav as-is would still largely erase impact at the moment, as room charges already don't really matter once the group is large enough. >.>"
Mutters states, "By my math."
Famine states, "That sounds reasonable. This scav change is also gonna make nails a bit harder to get too"
Crayon claims, "Yeah. I think you could probably decrease the number of rooms with them available, too? It's basically every P1/P2 room."
Ketavan nods at Famine.
Famine states, "Since I think we put nails in the 40-50 range"
Crayon says, "It shows up with 36 atm."
NotChloe claims, "Nice"
zombilicious finishes her note.
Crayon claims, "But changing it up into the 40-50 range could be a huge help."
Jamie is idle.
Jamie has returned from AFK.
zombilicious says, "Talking about canning made me want more uses for jam."
Ash asks of Sarah, "Good to shift into Mutters?"
Sarah nods at Ash.
Ash declares, "Okay! Mutters, you're up!"
Mutters states, "This may be IC stuff and probably can be resolved IC, but what I'm seeing is an alarming amount of Welders in the game. Like...about half the entire populace has at least 36 in welding by my count. And this may end up settling out as we get more crafts on grid, but having almost far too much work to do to immediately having zero work to do is pretty alarming, but I think that in time people will diversify and get into carpentry which we only have like 3 people by my count in, and tailoring which only has like 3 or 4 people? Just seems like we should spread out the skillset a bit more. Also, I'm going to submit a number of ideas for more welding recipes so that we can have more diversity in what we make other than just weapons, armor, jewelry, and canteens, like Nappist said."
Ketavan claims, "That really is just the crafting way. Eventually, the work will settle down and people will have a 'favorite' to go to or someone who's work they admire."
Corene claims, "I've been thinking about shifting from welding for this exact reason."
Sarah nods at Ketavan.
Nappist claims, "Add brigadine to the game as the major actual armor type"
zombilicious says, "I'm glad I took no wleding."
Petal claims, "I will admit, I went into welding -just- to do jewelry, but I can't skill up without making armor/weapons ;_;"
Ash states, "That would be a lot of help, RE: recipes. Pretty much agree on Ketavan. Seems to be the way. A craft gets trendy then nobody's doing all of a sudden, then trending again."
Anonymous claims, "I took no welding"
NotChloe claims, "I picked up welding because I didnt wanna do sewing again and now feel awkward because we have so many flops"
Corene claims, "I'm gonna swap to sewing, I think"
Mutters asks, "By my count it's something like fifteen people on a mud that caps at thirty?"
Nappist says, "Required armor plates cut from ingots, then you can use expensive silk to make high-quality armor into sewing"
zombilicious claims, "Same with me and Herbalism. I want to farm, but to up the skill, making medicine is useful."
Sarah states, "Taking some time learning how to pretty up strings and do extendeds and embellishments helps a lot if youre trying to draw customers in"
Corene muses, "I went welding as part of my char's backstory, but I can shift it if everyone okay with my handwaving that a little?"
Mutters questions, "And some of that is that repairing most armor is 36?"
Ketavan claims, "Unfortunately it's just that way in every MUD, it happened in AE and TI and every other RPI I've been to. You have 75 RP hours to work out the design, which is good, but sometimes it does just happen. All I can tell you is to find some craft you genuinely OOC'ly enjoy doing and get really good at it."
Mutters states, "To put it into perspective, I've got like 3 new welders in the past week that have little to no work to do because I'm pretty sure everyone has their weapons and armor built. Over time that probably evens out as we get a trickle of new players, so it's not so much feast or famine, but as someone who is trying to keep an eye on the flow of economy in the game, I'm trying to make sure that new players don't come in with expectations of having a rare and needed skill and near everyone already having it. So long term, I'm thinking car parts, plumbing pipes, lots of useful 'assemble' goods that welding can make that fulfill the same function as batteries in flashlights as ongoing cost of survival and also keeps the economy running."
Ash says to Corene, "Definitely keep the skill that suits your concept. It's okay."
Crayon states, "My main concern is finding ways to make all of the random crap people mass produce to pool useful or valuable even while they're flooding the market with them. With Welding I think this could be done by making the lesser armor pieces components for higher tier armor pieces, but I've got no clue on carpentry stuff."
Famine says, "I wonder if we should bump armor repairs up to 37"
Ash claims, "Best bet would probably be to salve them"
zombilicious is capping her sewing at 39 because her character can upcycle but not create new items.
Ketavan trails off to Famine, "The problem becomes 'what happens when you've got 10 people playing daily,' which is a bad thought but like..."
Murrmurs says, "Forcing repair to learn master invested PCs would be nice."
Petal claims, "Some of it doesn't salvage 🙁"
Misty claims, "I think that what is being said applies to every single skill, not just Welding, but maybe mostly to Welding? People are gonna find their niches eventually."
Ash says, "If you make a bunch of stuff you don't think you can sell or use, salvage for some return on the mats to keep going. Anything with more than 1 mat is typically salvageable."
Crayon states, "Most of it doesn't salvage, yeah."
Corene says, "To ash Part of the problem is I don't enjoy it and enjoy sewing more, which I'm realizing after I sorted the concept out. Well, I could keep a small bit of welding, which would stick with teh concept, and...whatever I'll think this out on my own, don't wanna derail, haahha."
Ash nods at Corene.
Anonymous claims, "I have insight into this"
Anonymous says, "If anyone wnats to hear it"
Petal muses, "Though, I can typo the ones that don't have a salvage with suggestions if that would help?"
Petal nods at Anonymous.
Ash says to Corene, "Yeah definitely just do what you feel enthused to do."
Famine claims, "Most stuff with more than one component in building it is salvageable, or typically we try to make it so"
Sarah claims to Corene, "Can totally drop the skill if you dont enjoy it, you can handwave your backstory a little while you're cyan"
Ash claims, "If it's not salvageable, it probably only has one 1 mat. You get about half back generally, so there's no half mat to give back."
Ruby is idle.
Lance is idle.
Ruby has returned from AFK.
NotChloe asks, "Am I salveagable?"
Petal questions, "Can you custom set the material that comes back?"
Petal muses, "Or is it always a component?"
Ash states, "Sadly no, it's set by the recipe."
Petal asks, "I mean, can staff on the recipe?"
Crayon states, "With the armors, for example, I think most use one mesh? So not many of them are salvageable."
Ash claims, "What's under the 'failures' list is what you get back when you salvage it, assuming it's more than one mat."
Anonymous states, "So... in terms of weapons and armor, this is something that I've seen in TI and in AE; typically, there ends up being grandmastered people who people go to for those things, and there is almost always at least one GM'd person in each 'camp' or faction. Weapons and armor don't generally wear out, so once you've got that sorted, you're set unless you want to change strings or mix things up. There's really no way to solve that."
Anonymous says, "HOWEVER"
Petal wonders, "So if you have armor that requires 1 mesh, can you have it give 1 ingot back?"
Petal says, "Or even 1 scrap of metal"
Ash claims, "Oh sure, that'd work fine I think."
Ash claims, "For the later recipes that are kind of nested it makes sense."
Mutters claims, "At least with salvage, you always need to lose something on salvage so people don't just build/salvage to pool."
Murrmurs holds on for the however.
Petal nods at Anonymous.
Famine states, "Weapons and armor wearing out is gonna be way more of a thing here John due to constant fighting of zombies."
zombilicious wants to know Anonymous' however also.
Anonymous says, "There may be a way to solve welding and other craft's staying relevant at low levels via tool repair. anyone whose read about anything medieival knows that the village blacksmith primarily ended up fixing people's tools. you could have uses on things like pots and pans and hammers and so forth, with welding being the providors of these tools that wear out to do other things"
Famine says, "The reason it generally doesn't wear out elsewhere is because pve is less of a thing"
Anonymous trails off, "Yes.... but repair isn't generally the same as 'make a new item'"
Anonymous states, "Unless you let it totally break"
Petal states, "I think having welders in each 'camp' kinda makes sense. You go to people you trust to make you good gear."
Anonymous states, "Which no one is gonna do"
Mutters says, "There's a significant amount of ingots spent in armor repair, that is correct."
zombilicious states, "Oh, yeah, that'd be cool too. Like if my frying pan needs to be fixed because I've hit too many zombies in the face with it."
Anonymous says, "DONT LAUGH AT ME ASH ILL REVEAL YOUR SECRET"
Ketavan states, "And again, we're only on week... 2? Of the MUD. A lot of the crafting push will die off, I'm just saying. People will rapidly lose interest."
Ash claims, "DO IT"
Petal claims, "I tried repairing a body armor piece and it kinda needed soooo much ingots."
Anonymous says, "OKAY FINE I WIL"
Anonymous says, "HEY GUYS"
Anonymous says, "GUESS WHAT"
Crayon says, "Kitten butt."
Anonymous says, "ASH SECRETLY LOVES THE FAST AND FURIOUS MOVIES. ESPECIALLY THE BAD ONES"
Ash twiddles thumbs.
Ash states, "TOO FAR."
Murrmurs has left the game.
Anonymous states, "YOU MADE ME DO IT"
Sarah says, "I love fast and furious movies"
Mutters says, "I will say that Ash's secret is being stricken from the record for forum posting."
Famine says, "I kinda do too. "
zombilicious states, "It's okay, I also like garbage movies."
Famine states, "But I didn't know Ash did"
Crayon states, "Wow, you broke Murrmurs."
Crayon claims, "You monster."
NotChloe states, "A lot of the 'people go to established and not new' crafter issue may just have to be solved with older crafters getting lower 'apprentices' to make some of the low tier bits for them."
Petal stares at Anonymous.
zombilicious says to Ketavan, "I think that's probably also true. People will find their niches."
Murrmurs wanders into the vicinity. [login]
Anonymous claims, "Also"
Corene says, "Anyone who says they don't love at least one garbage movie is lying"
NotChloe states, "It makes sense, generates rp and saves mv"
Anonymous states, "I would like to reiterate that the point of the game is rp"
Anonymous states, "Not who can get what mechanical thing done"
Anonymous states, "Or advantage"
Sarah claims to Ash, "If i havent told you about my WoD fast and furious session i need to"
Anonymous says, "Pls keep that in mind"
zombilicious goes to the welder she feels most comfortable with because her character is Very Shy.
Sarah claims to Ash, "I had never seen any of the movies so they elected me vin diesel"
Ketavan says, "As someone who wound up stealing a large amount of business from others via extended descs alone on AE, I can assure you that if you are passionate about a craft, they will come."
Sarah nods at Ketavan.
zombilicious states to Sarah, "The bisexual knitter. I see."
Petal nods at Ketavan.
Stitch is idle.
Famine claims, "So, I'm gonna say this about the crafter argument regarding 'camps'. As someone who has made crafters before and gotten into trying them, and seeing Ash get into them as a budding crafter elsewhere - this is a perception issue not an inherent system issue. This comes down to sticking with it, making yourself known, and advertising."
Ash says to Ketavan, "So much that."
Murrmurs nods at Ketavan.
Crayon says, "The issue is that most of the low tier stuff that apprentices can make that can be used by higher tier welders for example aren't going to help them pool at all, and the stuff they can pool off of is just going to sit there and may not even be salvageable."
Petal states, "Sometimes people just like your strings and will come for that."
Anonymous says, "Actually sato i just busted the other weaponmakers one too many times and they refused to make me anything"
Famine claims, "You don't just make something, be there, and expect to make sales"
Ketavan states, "If you're not passionate about a craft, you might as well hang it up. You'll be miserable."
Anonymous states, "Since you were the only one who even half knew how to cover your tracks when selling to the syndies, you got the job"
zombilicious says, "I love making things but I'm terrible about getting it out there. So I'm working on that part every day."
Sarah says, "I made a truly offensive amount of money on AE crafting clothes because i was super obnoxious with advertising and went ham on embellishments/extendeds and free extendeds if you use a screenreader"
Ketavan smiles at Anonymous.
Petal grins at Sarah.
Famine claims to Sarah, "Yeah"
Petal claims, "I would like to see TI style embellishes here."
Mutters says, "As a followup on the crafting thing, I've tried to hand off apprentice stuff that pools for them to them, but demand hasn't been as much lately. As a question to the community however, how do you feel about the 5s and 10s system? I'm basing the prices for buying and selling on the 63 credits newbies get each week, so I wanted to check in and see if buying for 5 rations per ingot and selling for 10 rations per ingot used seems fair."
Anonymous trails off, "That is true sarah but i will also point out that... you were literally the only person making clothing for a long time"
Murrmurs states, "Crafters are always the ones who end up rich. ;-;"
Famine states, "Doesn't matter if a faction has some grandmaster weapon crafter and armor crafter. If you're there making quality stuff and putting yourself out there, you're gonna sell eventually."
zombilicious says, "I don't make pretty extendeds with ASCII, I hope I don't have to."
Ketavan states to Anonymous, "You literally forgot that I was a crafter about a year into hiring me specifically to craft for you, so I'll take that with a mountain of salt."
Sarah claims to Anonymous, "I sold outfits for 30,000 space dollars though"
Stitch is no longer idle.
Anonymous claims, "Thats a lotta space dollars"
Petal says, "Where they add the short desc of the embellish item to the item being embellished so it looks super pretty"
Stitch has returned from AFK.
Crayon says, "Funnily, I think crafters are poor right now and filthy scavvers are rich."
Sarah states to zombilicious, "No, i generally dont do ascii at all"
zombilicious states, "Can confirm, I ask Crayon and Murrmurs for rations a lot."
Petal wonders, "Mutters, feel like that's too much of an IC question.. really?"
zombilicious states to Sarah, "Oh, good. Then I'm doing something right."
Anonymous states, "Rations drop from zombies so anyone killing zombies has a lot of them"
Violet claims, "0 rations gang"
Misty claims, "Maybe high tier crafters working on lower tier things doesnt pool very highly for them? Not sure if that's a thing. Maybe that'd incentivize people to hand it off to an apprentice for example."
Mutters states, "As a person with their pulse on the crafters, I think we're doing...middling, in general."
Famine states to Crayon, "That's likely a IC issue more than anything relating to people charging rations for their work."
Nappist states, "Scavvers are poor too, it's pretty much just people who kill zeds are rich, especially those who hit them when they were dropping at 100 percent"
Misty trails off, "Also makes it so people want to craft the more rare things... more pool"
Ketavan claims, "Eventually, Factions will generally be incentivised to take on apprentices. A lot of these issues are just that we're in week 2 and there's a MASSIVE influx of people all scrambling to be 'the one' to do something."
Sarah states, "I do feel like the reward is really skewed to favour people who just go out and club zombies, and my gut feeling is that zombies should be too scary to do that on the reg"
Murrmurs nods with Ketavan.
Ash nods at Ketavan.
Famine states to Misty, "Pooling cuts off on lower tier stuff as you rank up."
Petal says, "I once crafted a calendar that made me bank based on the descs alone 😃"
Misty claims, "Oh, sorry didn't know."
zombilicious says, "I got some of the redistribution on the zed-dropping stuff, but it definitely feels awkward. I think part if it is that I feel uncomfortable charging 20 rations for a granola bar."
Ruby states, "I think most of that money has already dried up. You really only make massive amounts of money on zombie hunts if you can solo them, or have a really small group. That's not possible with the new spawns."
Famine states to Misty, "Nothing to apologize for."
Sarah states, "But i know some people are super duper into that so i dont want to just wet blanket that while playing a pc who doesnt leave town"
Ketavan nods at Ruby.
NotChloe claims, "Chloe made ok on sewing but she was lucky in that everyone and their mum wanted quivers"
Famine asks of Ruby, "New spawns?"
Sarah nods at NotChloe.
Ruby muses, "There aren't new spawns?"
zombilicious says, "Chloe dying is why I had to wait until Sarah wasn't sick anymore to get a quiver."
Ruby states, "What's up with the groups of three zombies in the streets? Lol."
Crayon claims, "They spawn more abundantly in P2 and I think P1 too."
The '%' character is not usable in communication for code reasons.
Nappist claims, "Could also get rid of the abstraction with rat slips and make food the major moneymaker in game"
Corene states, "I've gone on several runs and have been earning 20-50 rations a run, which is fine but not mindblowing"
Mutters claims, "The 40 percent drop rate and the zombies clumping in new ways."
Crayon states, "There are a lot more groups 2 or even 3 deep in P2."
Famine states, "Ah right. We did raise them showing up more."
Petal states, "Still earning decent amounts with groups of 3-4 people going out."
Sarah states, "Ive been skinning and butchering rainbow brite dolls to decorate my scrap garments"
Corene claims, "I don't go for the money, I go for the RP/combat experience, but I'm also going in BIG groups"
Famine states, "Typically not gonna be 3 in the streets in a single room though. If you see 3, wait til one disappears."
Ketavan nods at Corene.
Famine claims, "Streets are mob capped at 2 at most."
zombilicious states, "It feels a lot more dangerous to walk around, which I personally like because a survival game without needing to survive isn't much fun for me personally."
Petal nods at zombilicious.
NotChloe says, "SORRY I DIED ZOMBILICIOIS"
Crayon claims, "Agree. I like the new spawns a lot."
Murrmurs claims to Famine, "I have been loving the increased volume of spawns around town."
Eli says, "There were 3/4 on p2 streets earlier not that im complaining"
zombilicious claims, "YEAH. YOU BETTER BE, CHLOE."
Sarah states, "Ooh i have another quick topic to tack on at the end after eli if we have time. or it can wait until next weeeek"
Ruby says to Famine, "On Cicada there were two groups of three, one west and one east. They never really moved, wasn't sure if that were intentional or not."
Crayon claims, "They do seem to sometimes get stuck in groups of three."
Famine states, "That might be because of the nowander room right outside the hospital"
NotChloe says, "I had to die to show people that zombie bad scary... it was my civic duty."
Sarah nods at NotChloe.
Famine muses, "Were they east and west of the hospital entrance?"
Atlas claims, "Zombies are bad and scary."
Mutters claims, "The prices I've set for The Union are based on the 63 rations everyone gets, so I think in general, 50-100 on a scav run is pretty notable, at that rate it'll take 1-3 runs to get a full set of armor and a weapon."
Petal questions, "East/west of potato field I think?"
Petal says, "Remember being blocked in after the BEEES"
Famine claims, "I might go through and mob cap p2 to 1 zombie to compensate so the most that clump is 2"
zombilicious says, "Last scav run I went on got me 125, but we went out for a while, in a high-peril area, so I don't think it was a bad amount of rations for the run."
Misty claims, "Uhh.. yeah. I've been that person blocked."
Lance is idle.
Famine says, "Or at least do that in those specific rooms"
Sarah states to NotChloe, "There was definitely some OH MY GOD THE THREAT IS REAL that went along with it"
Famine wonders to Ash, "Sorry, are we derailing?"
NotChloe declares, "Yaay!"
Petal nods at zombilicious.
Eli claims, "The threat is real"
Ash claims, "Maybe a bit"
Eli states, "Some people just deal with it different"
NotChloe trails off, "I have been moved at how much effect I saw her death have..."
Ash states, "We're past the hour I suppose. Should try to getthrough the topics."
Petal states, "Typically for me scav runs are about 50-150ish."
Ash inquires, "Petal, you ready with yours?"
Petal asks, "Okay, unpopular idea time: Is the faction code really necessary? Or could we do away with it? I think it actually might be worth while removing it entirely and keeping it down to roleplayed groups. The code doesn't actually seem necessary and currently doesn't seem to provide much in the way of functionality on an IC level (yet at least). And possibly has a part in encouraging higher levels of the PVP dynamic that we're trying to move away from. Thoughts? Can folk live without faction code? Or do you feel it is essential? If you want to keep it, how do you see faction code supporting it in a PVE way?"
Famine claims, "I do wonder if Faction code might actually encourage people to turn into gangs."
Anonymous claims, "Ive always been against factions ever since back in AE when orgs were phased out shrug"
zombilicious claims, "I could live without faction code. The only thing it seems to give is a shared bank account and a radio channel; we don't have HeadQuarters or anything, and I'm still hanging out with the same people I was before."
Eli states, "It helps set boundaries and will likely be expanded as the game grows imo"
Petal nods at Famine.
zombilicious inquires, "What boundaries do we need, though?"
Sarah states, "I could take or leave factions cause our main base is small enough that we pretty much just feel like a tfz faction"
NotChloe says, "I agree factions can be done without code"
NotChloe claims, "Just rp it"
zombilicious says, "We're supposed to be a community of survivors, we don't really need boundaries."
Ruby says, "It helps keeps things organized tbh. Otherwise I'd have to keep a list on a notepad somewhere."
Violet claims, "I definitely feels like it kind of encourages more of a PvP dynamic"
Sarah says, "We do have IC notepads and journals and stuff to keep notes like that"
Ketavan says, "I'd like to keep it because eventually I do see some Factions actually getting big and having lore and the like, creating cornerstones of the game that people can latch onto and investigate. We'd have gangs and bonding with or without the code, but the code allows you to give out actual benefits, ranks, and confer coded titles and the like without having to constantly re-up your RP or otherwise be online constantly, every hour of every day."
Crayon states, "The shared bank account is mildly useful in theory. I could mostly live without the code, though. I do like that it lets you provide some description for your group and what they do."
zombilicious states, "It's brought about some very uncomfortable Them and Us situations."
Eli says, "So people cant divide into roles and organise"
Ruby states, "I disagree with factions not being needed. Some conflict is going to occur because people are going to have different ideas on how to deal with the apocalypse. "
zombilicious says, "Uncomfortable in a situation of 'this feels weird'."
Ketavan states, "Frankly, people are and will continue to create us vs them scenarios, no matter what you do."
Sarah claims, "I dont mind the them and us tension but im largely separate from it"
Eli says, "Were not all gonna get along"
zombilicious states, "Conflict is going to occur even without factions."
Mutters "For my Faction, I originally thought that pshops were going to be tied to them, so I was going to Faction up to have a roster I can go through for dues and so I can keep a note on who does what crafts and accounting purposes. I also thought I could keep a pile of funds in the group and then pay people out for stuff? That's easy enough to do RP-wise, but I think the Faction code, IMHO is useful for me specifically, but not useful enough that it's vital.
Petal says, "I think a lot of the faction stuff could all be done with just RP."
zombilicious states, "You don't need coded factions to have conflict."
Eli claims, "Its nice to have the coded support all the same"
Ash states, "Some conflict, yes, but if somebody disagrees strongly enough they're causing problems they'd be kicked the hell out, so in that respect it's pretty self-regulating."
Petal muses, "What coded support does it give?"
Eli states, "I dont see what advantage there is to removing it"
zombilicious says, "I don't see the advantage to /having it/."
Eli inquires, "You are arguing for things that can happen with or without faction code so why remove it at all?"
Nappist says, "There are other things that are more concerning than faction code at the moment"
Corene says, "I think factions are useful, but it can also encourage cliquishness...but that can happen anyways. I don't know. I think maybe players should be very cognizant of the possibility of stagnation with factions, and have a set system for entry."
Eli claims, "Cliques happen."
Anonymous says, "I'm of the opinion that factions aren't needed and that having coded factions leads to division of the playerbase, as a psychological mechanism that draws an 'us vs them' line. we can go back and forth over whether thats good or not shrug"
Eli says, "Its an RPI."
zombilicious states to Corene, "Definitely cliques happen without factions, this is true."
Corene states, "For sure, Eli"
Petal claims, "That doesn't mean we shouldn't try to move away from cliques."
Eli says, "Dont penalize people for staying in their corners"
Petal says, "It's like the argument. Bullying happens. why stop it."
Misty states, "I think regardless of whether or not its coded, it would happen anyway. People just do that shit naturally."
Crayon states, "Agree that it leads to people thinking of things as an 'us vs. them' competition."
zombilicious says, "You can stay in your corner without a coded faction, though? I dunno."
Corene claims, "I was thinking out loud, which is why I ended with maybe players should be more cognizant, rather than....ending factions? I don't know."
Eli claims, "Thats a false equivalence lol"
Ketavan claims, "Re: Coded benefits - You get to establish lore for your faction that everyone can check out. People can see who is in or out of a faction, you can establish payment systems that you don't have to be around for... I think there's benefits - they're not insane, but there are benefit."
Ash claims, "Cliques aren't inherently bad. They become bad when they become a barrier to newcomers rather than something that accepts newcomers."
zombilicious states, "Like, I haven't heard anything that's changed my mind about faction code."
Eli says, "What Ketavan said"
Sarah claims, "Ket has a point about group lore and stuff and the titles and ranks and an easily accessible list"
Petal nods at Ash.
NotChloe claims, "Will agree it feels a little the coded factioms solidifies that divide from an oc mental perspective"
Nappist states, "I feel like it's important to have communication lines ICly and if factions help that that's good"
Ruby states, "Not everyone is going to play the same kind of character. As long as a faction isn't literally pillaging their way through the zone I don't see what the issue is tbh. Nobody is molotov'ing buildings or starting massacres in the streets."
Eli states, "You are all arguing to meld everything together for the sake of a safe space when the post apocalypse is way more varied than that"
Ruby says, "The divide that's there is purely political."
Nappist says, "Otherwise what will happen is people will just form metagroups in secondary discords and use that"
Nappist says, "Which will make cliques worse"
Eli claims, "And factions inevitably form"
Petal claims, "We've already seen that divide going too far this week."
Anonymous trails off, "The only thing that i see being missed from code faction is the ability to pool rations in a faction bank account but... you can just as easily accomplish that by designating one person as the ration bank"
Nappist states, "Honestly factions need more comm tools that are IC, not fewer"